Path: paganini.bofh.team!tor-network!not-for-mail From: "NightBulb.net" Newsgroups: alt.bible Subject: Re: What "proof" of God would you accept? Date: Wed, 18 Oct 2023 22:57:47 -0500 Organization: To protect and to server Message-ID: <20231018225747.72b89ce3.nospam@nightbulb.net> References: <0lv0ii1fb41mrsfrpa4asfsm5oghh67u7a@4ax.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Injection-Info: paganini.bofh.team; logging-data="57654"; posting-host="JkprVgHnXFvi2yL7k/9vvQ.user.paganini.bofh.team"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@bofh.team"; posting-account="9dIQLXBM7WM9KzA+yjdR4A"; Cancel-Lock: sha256:30Hp5gGPHk7SfjG0gv7qnziczLBd5xoSbIliY8YdklU= X-Notice: Filtered by postfilter v. 0.9.3 X-TOR-Router: sha256:MmEwZjpkZjAwOjA6MjU1OjoyMDQ= -- Xref: paganini.bofh.team alt.bible:663348 On Fri, 06 Oct 2023 18:24:07 -0700 Robert wrote: > > Is your faith wavering? > > Not at all, if I were asked by God to do something, I will do it. > > BTW, Elijah will return to the earth and call down fire from heaven > as he did before. As usual, your doctrine is contrary to the Bible. You are still picking cherries and splitting raisins and figs to prop up your preconceived notions. Jesus says that Elijah already returned and called down the fire from heaven: Matthew 17:12 But I say unto you, That Elias is come already, and they knew him not, but have done unto him whatsoever they listed. Likewise shall also the Son of man suffer of them. The "fire" that Elias called down from heaven in sight of men was his act of baptizing Jesus Christ in the Jordan River. Heaven opened, and the Holy Spirit (fire) descended in the form of a dove. This is the prophecy of Elijah fulfilled. So your doctrine is false, as usual. We learn that later, the anti-christ will call down fire from heaven, so those looking for this miracle of fire will be deceived by the anti-christ: Revelation 13:11-14 And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon. And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed. And he doeth great wonders, so that he MAKETH FIRE COME DOWN FROM HEAVEN ON THE EARTH IN THE SIGHT OF MEN, And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; So Robert claims Elijah will return and call down fire from heaven. But the Bible says the anti-christ will call down fire from heaven. Robert is a liar, false teacher, false accuser, and false Christian who does not rightly divide God's word. "Calling down fire from heaven" as used in the Bible scripture of Elijah's miracle is ancient Oriental metaphor for the testimony of the Holy Spirit destroying the enemies of that testimony (Ba'al prophets): "And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God. And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven." This is the "fire from heaven" or the Holy Spirit, or the "bolt out of the blue" that strikes a man, when God decides to strike him. It cannot be conjured up by Bible study, but happens only when God wants it to: "No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day. It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me. Not that any man hath seen the Father, save he which is of God, he hath seen the Father." Here Jesus says that only God can draw a man to the Father. And no man has seen God, unless that man is of God. So it is impossible for one man to prove the existence of God to another man. God will not do it, and he will not allow it. Faith is NOT by sight, but comes by the will of God through the "fire from heaven" which is the Holy Spirit. The ancient languages had mountains of metaphors like this. The invisible and immortal God is not interested in proving his existence to anyone. He did not call Christians to prove his existence to unbelievers. He is interested in testing mankind, to prove to mankind what blindness mankind suffers in their own hearts and minds. When a man sees, "fire from heaven" his mind is enlivened by the spirit so that his MIND is able to see the truth. Likewise, the anti-christ also calls down false fire, or a false testimony of a false spirit, that convinces men in their minds to follow the beast and the false prophet. Jehovah has proven His existence to me. It is not my job to go prove it to everyone else, as that is impossible for man to do. Every man of faith already has the witness given to himself, and doesn't need to try to recruit allies to bolster his own belief. The man of faith stands on his own, regardless of what the blind and unbelieving say or do. If you want proof that God exists, and you are demanding that another man provide such proof, you are demanding the impossible. You must seek such proof directly from God. Any man who says he can prove the existence of God by visible means is a charlatan. God is by nature invisible, and does not wish to be seen by sinful eyes: Isaiah 8:17 And I will wait upon the LORD, that hideth his face from the house of Jacob, and I will look for him. The Lord does not want men seeking Him because they see Him and have proven to themselves that He is mighty. He wants them seeking Him by faith, which is a much stronger love than that engendered by sight. This is why Jesus could not work miracles in the cities where people were hardened in their hearts by unbelief. The miracles were a testimony of the Holy Spirit for those that already had faith. Jesus did not perform miracles to convert people to believe the gospel. He did miracles to witness the glory of God to them who were seeking God. The chief mistake of many atheists is that they judge God based upon the claims of Christians. It never occurs to them that maybe these Christians are misinterpreting the bible, and that it is actually true after all. If you don't understand ancient Oriental idiom, you cannot possibly discern what the Bible says. > If you survive the nuclear attack by Russia, you might see it. Mark it that Robert has given a prophecy of a nuclear attack by Russia. When will this prophesied nuclear attack happen, Robert? Jeremiah 14:14 Then the LORD said unto me, The prophets prophesy lies in my name: I sent them not, neither have I commanded them, neither spake unto them: they prophesy unto you a false vision and divination, and a thing of nought, and the deceit of their heart. Jeremiah 5:31 The prophets prophesy falsely, and the priests bear rule by their means; and my people love to have it so: and what will ye do in the end thereof? -- NightBulb | https://nightbulb.net | Flip the night switch.