Path: paganini.bofh.team!weretis.net!feeder8.news.weretis.net!news.mixmin.net!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Nightbulb.net" Newsgroups: alt.bible Subject: Re: What is God's actual personal name? Date: Thu, 22 Sep 2022 21:13:10 -0500 Organization: Mixmin Message-ID: References: <62f1b49e$0$2256$1c4686b2@news.club.cc.cmu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Injection-Date: Fri, 23 Sep 2022 02:10:13 -0000 (UTC) Injection-Info: news.mixmin.net; posting-host="60254e3f23fca6a14f610385b9cd8004a58fa513"; logging-data="2558662"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@mixmin.net" Content-Language: en-US In-Reply-To: <62f1b49e$0$2256$1c4686b2@news.club.cc.cmu.edu> Xref: paganini.bofh.team alt.bible:650929 On 8/8/22 20:13, servant wrote: > There is no possible way it is "jehovah". That was a mistaken > transleration from the hebrew 4 letters as a guess of a rc monk in > themiddle ages. Leaving aside the linguistic details it is more like"YHWH" > using hebrew letter sounds . There was no initial "y" sound in latin then; > so he used a "j" as his first mistake. This is the myth of Galatinus. This is a folk etymology and a fantasy cooked up by Catholics and Yahwist Rabbis to discredit the English Bible and replace it with their Pagan and Jewish fables. Firstly, Sephardic Jewish translators and copyists, all through history, pronounced the tetragrammaton as Je-ho-vah. This did not change until the Ashkenazi Yahwish converts from Eastern Europe and Khazaria came along a couple centuries ago with their unfounded theories. We must recall that the Sephardic Jews were descended from the actual ancient Judeans, and were the group that preserved the Hebrew scriptures. The Sephardi mixed with various people in North Africa, the Levant, and southern Europe, and spread across those regions. The Ashkenazi Jews lived a continent away, and were pagan steppe-dwellers until the Khazarian empire converted to Judaism. They were converts, and not at all descended from the Judeans of Palestine. Taking their myths and fairy tales of syncretic paganism mixed with Judaism, over the unbroken, written history of the Sephardi, is just stupid. Yet people do it. This myth is a lie and it has no basis in history. It is a lie with no source that was repeated until people believed it. The promoters of the false name, "Yahweh" like to spout this fairy tale. They even go as far to say there was no "J" sound in ancient Hebrew which is a patent falsehood. Ancient Hebrew, centuries before the adoption of the Aramaic alphabet and the Tiberian vowels and pronunciations, used the same alphabet as proto-Greek, with the same letters, and the same sounds. Modern scholars, being idiots, never mention the fact that the ancient Hebrew alphabet is the same as the proto-Greek, which was also used by the Phoenicians. Since the early Hebrews used the Greek alphabet to write Hebrew, there is a clear connection between the original Israelites and the Dorian and Daanan Greeks which historians tend to neglect. In ancient Hebrew and proto-Greek the letter 'I' or 'jot' had two sounds, exactly as it had in medieval English. If the 'I' or 'jot' came before a consonant, it was pronounced, 'ee'. If it came before a vowel, it was pronounced, "dz" or "j" as in "jam" or "Jehovah." The same rules applied across many languages that borrowed from the same alphabet, including English. This rule for 'I' was used in English for centuries, until a typogropher started putting a hook on the "I" to distinguish its use as a consonant. Thus the letter J was born. Some lexicographic idiots claim that there was no "J" sound in English before the letter "J" was invented by a typographer. This is sheer idiocy. The letter "I" had the sound of "J" for many centuries until the stylistic change was made and caught on. The Name 'Yahweh' is from the Canaanite "Yahwii" and is a Canaanite storm deity, analogous to the Northern European "Thor." It is impossible to get this pronunciation from the phonology and grammar of the Hebrew IHWH. Yahwists twist the meaning of Exodus with their "I AM" fallacy to support this myth. The name, Jehovah, or IHWH, does not mean, "I AM." It means, "Lord." In ancient Hebrew, 'I am' is ANIKWA, pronounced, awn-aychwa, or in some grammatical cases, just 'aychwa' and it is cognate to the European, 'ego'. "Jehovah" means "Lord", as the scripture shows: Gen 22:14 And Abraham called the name of that place Jehovah–jireh: as it is said to this day, In the mount of the Lord it shall be seen. "Jehovah Jireh" means literally, "mountain of the Lord" or "mountain of my master." It could also be construed poetically to mean, "Lord of the Mountain" as in "King of the Hill." It does *not* mean, "mountain of i am." That's just kabbalistic nonsense. Exod 17:15 And Moses built an altar, and called the name of it Jehovah–nissi: "Jehovah nissi" means literally, "The Lord, my banner." It does not mean, "I am is my banner." The Lord said unto my Lord, Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool. The Jehovah said unto my Jehovah, Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool. One Jehovah is master over the other. Jesus asked the Pharisees to tell him the meaning of this scripture. They could not answer. In the Hebrew JHWH, or IHWH, the first letter is pronounced as a consonant. The second letter, 'eh' or 'heh' is a aspirated long 'ee' sound. It is not, and never was a short 'a' sound or a hard 'h' sound. This tells you the actual pronunciation of the name, Jehovah. I am not going to further explain it lest you misuse it. At the time of Galatinus (Galatino Colonna) the German Jews used the form Jehovah. Even the German word, "Jehova" was pronounced with the "J" sound even though the Germans usually used "J" as a vowel. > Transliteration tries to duplicate the sound of a word in one language by > using the similar letter sounds in the new language. The reformers all knew this name and they used it. They knew its correct pronunction, which was approximated as close as possible by the English and German letters they used to transliterate it. Before you spout off about transliteration, etymology, or philology maybe you should know something about the subjects. By repeating the myth of Galatinus, you show you don't know what you are talking about. > In greek the name for "Christ" is "kristos". When put into english > "Christ" the letter sounds were chosen to sound somewhat like the greek. > In other languages of europe it is a sound variation of "kristos" also. In ancient Greek 'christ' was 'hristos' which is a shortening of a form of 'aristos' which is analogous to 'aristocrat.' It means more than 'anointed one.' > However, the "kristos" is a translation of the word messiah", the sounds > are irrelevant. An existing greek word "kristos" has the same meaning of > as hebrew "messiah",ie. "the annointed one". in both languages. And you have demonstrated no understanding of the meaning of these words. They do not mean merely, 'anointed.' It is a much more concrete and nuanced metaphorical meaning, based on a visible object. I will give you a clue: "The sun of righteousness shall arise with healing in his wings." The Hebrew word, "Messiah" refers to a visible manifestation of a mountain being anointed by the light of the rising sun. > "The rc monk did a transliteration,ie. sounds like jehovah for what he > thought the 4 hebrew letters for God's name sounded like using latin letter > sounds. If he wanted to use the latin word for the meaning of the hebrew > letters for the name of God he would have used the latin "Deus" instead, > the letter sounds in either language are irrelevant. See above. This never happened. It's a false myth. Christian Greek and Hebrew scholars of Luther's day who were involved in translating the bible into English and German all unanimously agreed on the name, Jehovah (or Iehovah, Jehova, etc.) All of them were Greek and/or Hebrew experts. None of them got their pronunciation from the fabled Catholic monk or from the Latin. They translated the name from Greek and Hebrew texts, not from the Latin. The KJV is prized because of the excellent scholarship that went into transliterating between the ancient tongues and English while maintaining much of the ancient poetic meaning throughout. > The jw demand that the mistake of the mlonk's transliteration is the real > meaning of God and His "real name". So they illy nilly substitute a > non-existing "jehovah" for the english God in their "bible translation" and > spread and reenforce the monk's mistake. So it would be for the jw more > correctly "Deus witnesses", no? The idea of 'sacred names' originated with Babylonian mystery religion or Kabbalism and is a doctrine of demons. The Hebrew name, "Jehovah" means LORD. It means the same thing as the Greek Kurios. Thus the English translation to "Lord" is perfectly accurate. -- Nightbulb https://blog.nightbulb.net Flip the night switch.