Path: paganini.bofh.team!weretis.net!feeder8.news.weretis.net!news.mixmin.net!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "NightBulb.net" Newsgroups: alt.bible Subject: JEHOVAH vs YAHWEH - Yahweh is the Roman Jupiter Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2022 10:50:10 -0600 Organization: Mixmin Message-ID: References: <63a5e3a6$0$2252$1c4686b2@news.club.cc.cmu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Injection-Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2022 20:59:55 -0000 (UTC) Injection-Info: news.mixmin.net; posting-host="d193e872d1e24a3037ee30f47146a21e52b80d1b"; logging-data="1158702"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@mixmin.net" Content-Language: en-US In-Reply-To: <63a5e3a6$0$2252$1c4686b2@news.club.cc.cmu.edu> Xref: paganini.bofh.team alt.bible:654234 On 12/23/22 11:21, servant wrote: > Friend james is faced with the below facts that he has not heard from the > jw vatican. Them facts are such stubborn things; aint they? Keep this one > in mind, the jw vatican has *zero* greek/hebrew scholars, that explains the > errors they make out of ignorance: > > First the words transliteration and translation should be understood in the > following facts. Transliteration means to pick similar sounds in one > language and finding similar souds to use in another. For example, > "Christos" is the origin of the english "Christ". > > Translation uses the meaning of a word and finding the word with the same > meaning in another. The greek "christos" is a translation of the hebrew > "messiah". The meaning in greek and hebrew is "the anointed one". > > The NT written in greek uses "God/Lord" while the hebrew OT has multiple > words for God., the same words Christ and the apostles used, and thus > appears in the NT. > > 1. Jehovah was created by a misunderstanding. This is a lie and the information you provide is a false myth. The name JEHOVAH was used for many centuries before Galatinus. The Galatinus fairy tale is a fake story with no actual historical proof. It is fiction. What is not fiction, is the use of the JEHOVAH form for many centuries before Galatinus supposedly invented it. The Ben Asher Hebrew Text of 980 was the final version of the Masoretic Text used by almost all European scholars to learn how to read, write, and pronounce Biblical Hebrew. In that text the vowel points vocalize JEHOVAH as the correct pronunciation. All the European scholars and the Sephardi Levites agreed on this pronunciation. There was no debate whatsoever on the matter and no question of its accuracy and authenticity. Galatinus didn't come along yet for several centuries, with the contrived myth of the Adonai vowel pointings being superimposed. Stop. Repeating. Lies. Stop. Repeating. False. History. STOP. STOP! STOP! Just stop it already! The nonsense is crazy-making! The name of the Father is JEHOVAH or IEHOVA, pronounced with the "J" sound. That is how it has always been pronounced from the time He revealed it to Moses onward. The Sephardi Levites preserved the oral traditional pronunciation, and later the the Masora Levites faithfully preserved this name and its vocalization for hundreds of years from the diaspora of 70 a.d. onward. JEHOVAH was always pronounced with a "J" sound, not a "Y" sound. The letter JOT before a vowel or semivowel has the "J" sound and not the "ee" sound. When you read ancient Hebrew, a letter JOT before a vowel or semi-vowel is pronounced with the "J" sound. Before a consonant the letter JOT is pronounced with a "EE" long 'e' sound. Behold: ISRAEL -> EES-RA-EL -> JOT before a consonant, long EE sound. IEHOVAH -> JE-HO-VAH -> JOT before a semi-vowel as vowel, J sound. JASHAR -> JAH-SHAR -> JOT before a vowel, J sound. The Hebrew letter HEH or EH is a semi-vowel. It is neither a vowel or consonant but serves both purposes. Even without the vowel points the pronunciation of JHWH is clear! It is impossible to pronounce this word as YAH'WEH from Hebrew grammar! Even without the vowel points it would still be pronounced one of several ways, one of which I show here: J'OH-VAH which is almost the same as JE-HO-VAH. Both pronunciations are correct since they are almost identical and there are no other words that sound like them. This pronunciation omits the first soft "H" sound. That's the only difference to the pointed version of the word. The other pronunciations without vowel points I will not disclose to avoid providing fodder for some heretic or book pumper or mendacious money muppet to claim he has a new revelation or some such nonsense. I do not want to provide more ammunition for the sacred namers to shoot at the scripture. > First, Jehovah is the weirdest kind of portmanteau: it's 1) the vowels > of one Hebrew word (Adonai) inserted into 2) the consonants of another > (Yahweh), with the result then 3) transliterated into various European > languages. This is the colossal error I mentioned. We're not quite sure who > did it--though a sixteenth-century friar named Galatinus is often > blamed--but we're pretty sure we know why. The Jewish custom of avoiding > saying the divine name meant that the four consonants of Yahweh (Y-H-W-H) > came to be spelled with the vowels of Adonai as a reminder to say the > latter instead of the former. This is all nonsense and myth. The vowels are not the vowels of Adonai. If you actually look at the vowels you would see that. Did you ever actually open up a Ben Asher Masoretic codex and compare the vowel points? The pronunciation of JEHOVAH is clearly in the Ben Asher text of 980 a.d., a full 400 years before Galatinus. Also Galatinus was regarded as a nit-wit by the real Hebrew scholars of his time. Galatinus claimed to be a Protestant, yet based the authority of some of his arguments on the dogmas of the Catholic Church and the Talmud, which was widely criticized by competent scholars of his day. The Tetragrammaton is JHWH. There is no "Y". The Adonai myth is pure myth. > Apparently someone (Galatinus?) didn't realize what was going on and > thought the traditional pastiche was itself a word: Jehovah. This custom > spread and the word still exists today. But it all stems from a > misunderstanding. I have debunked this nonsense twice prior and posters here keep regurgitating the same Roman propaganda to get people worshiping IOVE, the fake prince of demons. The word, YAHWEH is the Anglo-Latin name of the Roman God IOVE. The Latin IOVE is pronounced, YAH-WEH. "IO" = YAH ; VE = WEH. Other forms include the Greek IABE. JUPITER is from Latin IOPATER, and means YAHWEH FATHER. > 2. The New Testament translated Yahweh rather than transliterating it. > > The New Testament itself is the second reason we shouldn't use Jehovah > in Bible translations. The apostles could have transliterated Yahweh into > Greek, matching it letter for letter. That's what we usually do with proper > names when we put them in a new language (which is why "John" has a silent > H in it to this day). But instead they followed the example of the > Septuagint--the pre-Christian Greek translation of the Hebrew Old > Testament. They translated Yahweh using the Greek word for "Lord," Kurios. This is mostly true. However there are several places where JEHOVAH is a personal or descriptive name and is not being used to mean THE SUPREME LORD, and there it should be transliterated rather than translated. Look, you people of this newsgroup. I used to believe some of the dumb nonsense you all still believe. Then I wised up. I left religion and religious authority behind to follow Jesus. I actually pulled out the texts and looked at words in the ancient languages and found the original sources which show all of these fairy tales have no original source. They are made up nonsense. You will NEVER find the truth in these matters from the Church, or from "authorities" or any of that mystical, man-made nonsense. You must reject ALL authority before you can find your legs strong enough to stand up and reach for the truth. "And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a spectacle of them openly, triumphing over them in it." When Jesus cried out the verse from Psalm 22 on the cross, Jesus was abolishing all religious authority forever. Go read Psalm 22. There is NO religious institution from that day to this day in almost 2000 years that has any authority given to it by God. They are all false. You must reject them all and all their doctrines, and go find the truth for yourself. The power of sin is in the religion. We who are born of God triumph over the power of sin. God did not authorize state-chartered corporations called, "Churches" or "Ministries" to represent Him. Never, never, never did He do such a thing. His authority comes by way of the holy spirit, not by formal organization of a bureaucratic machinery. "Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power." In sum: The name Jehovah is the Hebrew name of the Father. The name Joshua, meaning, "Jehovah saves" is the Hebrew name of the Son. Jehovah translates into LORD in English. Jesus translates into LORD SAVIOR in English, and is JESUS in the Greek. The name is not 'yahweh' or 'yashua' or 'yeshua' or "yah-zoos" or any of that new-fangled nonsense from European rationalists and Ashkenazi converts or Hebrew rooters or sacred namers. The real Levitical Jews of the Masora preserved the name of Jehovah for us and everything to the contrary is nonsensical myth and lies from men trying to exercise religious authority over the minds of other men, a wicked practice that was made a spectacle and abolished at the cross. If you desire to learn how to do REAL textual criticism you must reject all ecclesiastical authority and study from the works of men who also rejected and fought against religious authority, as the many Protestant scholars of the Reformation, and the Masoretes who rejected the rabbinical authorities of the Talmudists when preserving the Hebrew Old Testament for a thousand years. The people who brought us the bible rejected the claims of authority of religious institutions, and held up the cry of Sola Scriptura as the authority over a man's fledgling faith. Sola Scriptura did not originate with Martin Luther. The Hebrew Scholars before him also believed in Sola Scriptura and it shows in their centuries of work. Chief among the Sola Scriptura crowd were the Masoretes who preserved the name of Jehovah in the texts. All persons promoting other names in its place were all promoting some human or religious authority as the basis for their argument. You've got to get out from under the boot heel of religion to stand up and see clearly. It's that simple. Leave the Church. All of them. Leave all the religious institutions. They're all nests of vipers that prey upon women, widows, orphans, and children. Leave the Synagogues. Leave the Mosques. Leave them all and go be free. Do not call any man on earth your father or your pastor, for there is one father in heaven and one pastor, Jesus Christ, comprehended in the supreme Godhead JEHOVAH ELOHIM. We hear his voice, and not the voice of any other. -- Nightbulb | https://blog.nightbulb.net | Flip the night switch. If tacky red hats annoy Pharisees I want to buy hats for the whole town.